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Stoll Keenon Ogden PLLC
Indiana University Robert H. McKinney School of Law, 1996
Why did you decide to enter the legal profession?
I decided I wanted to be a lawyer when I was 6 years old. Growing up, my bedroom was next to my parents’ room and my bed was next to the common wall that separated the rooms. Each night they would watch “Perry Mason” and I would put my ear to the wall and just become enthralled with the courtroom dialogue. So I was a legal geek long before my legal career began.
What does “diversity, equity and inclusion” mean to you?
It means we are on a journey to strengthen and grow our firms and businesses. It means a collective realization that bringing together diverse individuals with differing backgrounds, abilities and perspectives will yield better outcomes and positively impact the bottom line. But it also means recognizing the uniqueness and humanity in all of us.
How did you get involved in DEI work, and why have you stuck with it?
My first job as a lawyer was with a very good firm, filled with many wonderful people, none of whom looked like me. I was, for a few years, the only African American attorney in the firm. That presented some real challenges and very uneasy days. Those early difficulties trying to find space to be myself while never surrendering to others’ conception of me taught me a great deal about the need for recruitment and retention of attorneys of color. Thankfully, as a profession, we continue to make slow but meaningful progress.
What would you say to someone who perceives “DEI” as a business “buzzword”?
I would tell that person to “use the Google” to find the many studies that show a clear correlative relationship between business performance and diversity. It is certainly easy to call DEI a buzzword, but it does not take much digging to find examples of measurable change achieved through hard work.
What is the most significant change you’ve seen in the legal profession since you began your career?
While we do have a long way to go, I have seen the legal profession continue to move ever closer to looking like America. More importantly, I have seen the profession fully embrace this difficult but achievable goal.
What is the best advice you have ever received?
The best advice I ever received came from my grandmother. She said, “First, be kind.”
How do you spend your free time?
I am a bit of an oenophile. My wife, Tammy, and I recently spent a few days in Oregon wine country, which included attending the International Pinot Noir Celebration at Linfield University. I love the law more than wine, but it is a very close race!
What was your favorite — and least favorite — class in law school?
Least favorite was professor Jegen’s Income Tax class. I genuinely liked him, but I hated the subject matter. My favorite class was Trial Advocacy and Practice taught by Larry Landis. I knew I wanted to be a trial lawyer when I started law school, but I did not know how much I would love it until that course.
Your work in the DEI space is extensive. Looking at that work holistically, do you have a proudest moment?
Last year I received the Dr. John Morton-Finney Jr. Award for Excellence in Legal Education from the Indianapolis Bar Association. The award was given for my work in creating Classrooms to Courtrooms. Dr. Morton-Finney was a civil rights activist, lawyer and educator who taught in the Indianapolis Public Schools for more than 47 years.
In 1995, during my third year of law school, I was president of the Black Law Students Association, and it was my privilege to accompany Dr. Morton-Finney when he came to speak at the school. He was 106 years old, still practicing law out of his home and with a razor-sharp wit.
Before his lecture to the students, I sat with him and Dean Norman Lefstein in the dean’s office and learned so much about Dr. Morton-Finney’s life — the struggles and the triumphs. That meeting was a once-in-a-lifetime experience with a civil rights and legal icon. I am still not able to adequately convey my pride in establishing Classrooms to Courtrooms at his beloved Arsenal Technical High School.
Tell us about the C2C program. What is your interest in working with students?
The full name of the program is: Classrooms to Courtrooms: Building Broader Pipelines to Legal Education, and it is designed to do just that — build a broader pipeline and network for students of color and those from underserved communities who have some interest in a legal career or are just curious about it. While Classrooms to Courtrooms focuses on litigation through mock trial, it also provides the students exposure to a wide variety of practice areas and skill sets for attorneys and other legal professionals at all levels. The program began in 2021 after I reached out to Principal Corye Franklin at Arsenal Technical High School, who put me in contact with Dawn Walker-Seyerle, who taught the school’s Law Education course. We worked on a syllabus with Ms. Walker-Seyerle wherein she would teach the class one day per week and volunteer attorneys from my firm would teach the other class each week, and we would find volunteers to coach one or more teams for the Indiana High School Mock Trial Competition, sponsored by the Indiana Bar Foundation. In our first year, we taught two classes (one semester for each) with a total of 32 students, and we coached one team of eight students to the mock trial competition. Last school year, the second year of the program, we expanded a full-year course. We grew to four classes with a total of 84 students, and we entered two teams (20 students) in mock trial. The kids also found the time to start the Mock Trial Club, which is made up of interested students who are not enrolled in the Law Education course. We are now in a well into our third year of the program with five classes, 165 students and expect to coach three to four mock trial teams. The mock trial competition requires proper courtroom attire, the payment of registration fees and other expenses, so we have been able to raise money from many outside sources so that cost is not a barrier for any kid who wants to participate. I am overjoyed by the success of the program as an outlet for kids who would not otherwise have this experience, but also the realization that we are building a pipeline of excited, energetic young people who are interested in this profession that has given me so much.
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